Copy protection/DRM

[Jambi]

This may be a bit premature and you may not want to disclose anything at this point but...

Will DRM/Copy protection be used. I ask because often times it does more harm than good to consumers' systems (star-force anyone?). I don't pirate games, I buy them. I just hate some piece of software freaking out and not allowing me to run a game because I have a DVD-R drive that I record home movies with.

IMO DRM/Copy protection does not work but many have arguments for it.

1. It stops the casual pirate/copier.

Not anymore. Not when the casual copier is a tech-savvy teenager/young adult that knows how to find a torrent/use google.

2. It stops the unauthorized copying of software.

Maybe only to those with only half a desire to copy a game. People that really want to pirate/copy will find a way to copy the darn thing.

3. It disallows the running of pirated/unauthorized copies of the game.

How long does it take before a NO-CD crack is out?

Now, I'm not saying nothing should be done about pirating. I'm saying that DRM does nothing to stop it and can cause havoc to consumers' computer. I really like the way Stardock does their business and I think that having no DRM on their products has been nothing but a boon for them. Of course I am in no way trying to imply that L3o do something a certain way because someone else does it that way, L3o is its own company and things will be done how the powers to be decide is best, I just wanted to offer an example that most might be familar with.

Sorry if this came off as a rant, that was not my intention. I have two intentions to this post. The first is to find out if copy protection is going to be used. Secondly is to spark a discussion and hear what everyone thinks about the issue.

I also know I'm new around here (despite the '69 join date ). I'm not trying to troll, I'm just excited about a game that has managed to get me excited, what else can I say?

-Jambi
[creeps off behind a large, conviently place rock to watch from afar]

[Jambi]

Oh yea, all that stuff is just my humble opinion that originates from my own experiences over the years. I cannot back up anything with data or stats and I know that my arguments are not comprehensive. So don't be too mean.

[Therlun]

That would fit perfectly in my what can we learn from: Galciv" thread

Galciv 2 has no copy Protection either, and Stardock is one of the few companies that do not waste money on Starforce and alike...

read the news on http://www.galciv2.com/ about it if you want.

Especially the Starforce Creators giving a link to a working torrent is funny

[Jambi]

I did read the news at galciv2, quite interesting if you ask me. I do think it's funny that starforce acted that way, it reminds me of an upset child that did not get his or her way. Starforce is probably miffed that stardock did not waste a bunch of money on their product. I wonder how much it costs per unit for a DRM product?

[Zaimat]

I very much agree with your view on CD protection. I don't like it as a gamer myself so unless a publisher forced us (little chance of that happening considering Horizon would belong to us) we would never use such protection if any.

I myself have had cd-roms that couldn't be read due to the CD copy protection. I also think people should be able to make backups freely.

I believe stardock employs serial numbers as protection and since a lot of their sales comes online it wouldn't make sense to use CD protection anyway so it's a no brainer. Plus it's good PR

Most companies that sell online traditionally rely on just serial numbers. Where as big game companies/publishers tend to do a vast majority of their sales in retail and even though we don't like CD protection it probably does (or did) work for the casual consumer (often less sophisticated) who buys EA sports or XCraft from making copies for his friends.

Do you guys remember the old copy protections? hehe I had games with wheels (3 wheels that you rotated to get the code), master of orion 1 protection was actually fun (after a while I could do it from memory). Those were creative ways that actually were games in itself.

Most likely we will just be using a serial number to identify legitimite users unless we can come up with something else as simple and creative.
_________________
Horizon - Lead Designer

[Jambi]

[Zaimat]

We hope to have an online distribution as well as retail.
_________________
Horizon - Lead Designer

[Warcaster]

Freespace and Freespace 2

two more fine examples of a game that doesnt have any CD protection barriers. infact in the FS2 readme it actively encourages people to copy the CD.-awesome

and it hasnt hurt the sales any, a quick look at the activity of the modding community shows you that.

CD protection is just a greed factor put in place by corps that want to squeeze every penny they can from a game.

Warcaster

[Jambi]

[RobHuntingdon]

We had a brief discussion of this over on OS too. I found Citizen Lancia's post on Galciv2 forums and thought this really needed to be discussed.

IMO, DRM is a serious waste of money. It just doesn't get the job done, and it annoys paying customers. Shoot sometimes people will buy a copy of the game and then never even open the game package and just play the torrent version because they figure they won't get the real version to work. And there are way too many other options, such as serial numbers with online validation or something, that may not be perfect but at least they don't "bite the hand that feeds you" so to speak. There are always unlock code options if you want to support non-internet folks. Then again, what gamer doesn't at least have dialup these days? And most probably have DSL or cable I'd bet.

Heh, anybody remember the code wheel from StarFlight 1? I had a good nostalgic chukle remembering that critter. For those who never played, basically you had a two-level wheel that you spun around to a certain combo and then you typed in a code. You had to do this every time you left spacedock, so after awhile -- especially in SF2 where the code was a lot harder to handle -- you tended to come back to spacedock only when you absolutely had to. If you typed it in wrong the first time it would fail out and you could try again. On the second wrong answer you were let out of spacedock, and about 15 minutes later the "Space Police" would come after you! They would again demand your code, and if you failed the third time they'd blow up your ship and game over!

It really would have been annoying had you just goofed all three times, but that's what saved games are for, right?

RH
_________________
Robert, the Earl of Huntingdon

Tarry here, my merry men, whilst I seek what adventure await in yonder greenwood; but look thou listen for my call, for I will blow my horn if I become hard-pressed.

Adapted from Sterling, pg. 45