Ground Combat

[Sabin]

How will you be handling Ground Combat in the game... if any at all?
_________________
Where are we going?
and what's with this handbasket?

[Sobriquet]

I think that the troop movements of MOO1 were perfect in their simplicity. I imagined it as forced conscription of a local populace.

The overall system is unemcumbered by differnt types/models of units. The player merely upgrades armement and provides it to the population being forced into the miltary.

Recent games have tried (and failed) to flesh out complex ground attack systems. I say keep it simple. Although, I would like to see some sort of tactics . Kinda like a play book. The attacker picks a play and its outcome is weighted against the defenders 'called play'. Combat modifiers would be prioritzed, but a well-called 'blitz' would put the smackdown on a 'quaterback sneak'.

(If this makes no sense, sorry 'cause it makes perfect sense in my head.)

[Zaimat]

[Zaimat]

[Ravana]

Thanks for the clarifications Zaimat. It would seem that I, at least, view these things in terms of past games. (Then again, don't we all?)

You were understood loud and clear Sobriquet. In essence this isn't a bad plan as I've often thought that despite having a simple ground comabt system, this should not prevent the importance of a single planet turning into a long, drawn-out battle. How often do you read this in sci-fi, only having never seen it in a strategy game?

Look at Nu-Earth in 'Rogue Trooper' - that planet was the conerstone for both groups' interests in space. Neither was willing to concede it. Initially from strategic concerns, and then out of pride (and stupidity).

I would imagine that with some application of "factored" combat, you could utilise your method to produce a convincing ground combat system. Terrain, supply, equipment, air/ground support etc. could all be allocated to the matrix and the defenders would have the advantage in comparing the "scores". Even if the assault was a success, the attackers may find they have to win against continued guerilla warfare. Blockading would really play an important part in space strategy that way.

[Sobriquet]

[Ravana]

[The Griffos]

Zaimat - just checking to see if there is anything you can feed us in the way of an update on ground combat.
Not nagging - just checking.
Can you give us any indication wether we will actually be able to see some kind of graphical display of the actual fighting.I feel this gives more of a feeling of the combat actually occuring rather than just a set of stat's telling you the results or ongoing situation.
My thoughts are that the actual graphical display is really important - being able to control what happens would be good but not essential if not available.
Cheers

[Zaimat]

We are trying to make the ground combat as visual as possible but keeping it more of a general's perspective.

Meaning you won't be seeing actual soldiers/tanks shooting at each other but a representation of divisions and armies.
_________________
Horizon - Lead Designer

[Ravana]

So more like 'Risk' than 'Squad Leader'. Sounds groovy to me, but we will have some control over deployment and combat at all?

[Zaimat]

I don't want to say more at this point because it's still too early. There will definately be some decision making.
_________________
Horizon - Lead Designer

[Ravana]

[Zaimat]

There are 3 parts to ship construction (design). Weapon bays, core systems, and misc bays.

All ships have the same amount of core systems (8 including engines, scanners, attack and defense systems, life support, etc)

Weapons and misc bays are based on ship class size. These are still subject to change but for example a small ship has 2 weapon bays and 1 misc.

All weapons, bombs, etc go into the weapon bays where as everything else (such as troops) in the misc bays. Of course there are other factors, for example you need a medium or bigger size ship with a misc bay free for ground troops quarters.[edited]

[Zaimat]

There is basic ground combat in the game thus far. A pre-liminary version. It will be seeing some changes soon. I will speak more on it when I can.



I know some folks would like to see a major effort put into a detailed ground combat in a TBS. And we have considered even tactical ground combat implementation where you can move, position and fire with your ground troops but alas it would require too much resources so those ideas are on a list of things for a future version.
_________________
Horizon - Lead Designer

[redflag]

why not use the ground combat concept of a verry old pc game called Stellar Crusade or even the ground combat idea of MoO3. Basically you build divisions just like you build ships( armored divisions, infantry divisions, special forces) Each different type of division would have its advantages and disadvantages.[edited]

[The Griffos]

If possible I would at least like to see some kind of graphic display of ground combat - didn't like it in MOO3 where it was more of a radio show - even if we can't get to tactical control it would be great if we could at least plan the tactics then watch them played out (actually seeing shots fired & troops hit etc) - maybe something similar to MOO2 but with updated graphics would be good.
Thoughts anyone?

[Sobriquet]

[Ravana]

I remember the MoO2 ground combat all too well Griffos! It was cold comfort really to know that your troops were equipped with the best the empire could field. Not being able to control them was annoying, as was the inability to deploy anything other than troops; seemed a bit redundant to produce battleoids or tanks really. I can't say that I've ever seen them used in planetary defence.

With IG2 we had tanks, "artillery" and air support against mobile and static defences. With the right equipment late in the campaign, it was the only type of battle I bothered about. Fleet combat was too messy, but with individual control you could achieve objectives without losing tanks. Something the computer never managed to do.

Whilst nice, I suppose it's all moot really, as there are far more important things to finish and "get right".

We'll probably have to wait for Horizon to sell phenomenanlly well, so we can see ground combat fully realised in H2.

[redflag]

The combat could be abstracted like most other spaceplotation games are except it would be nice if you could have armies rather than settlers fighting for a cause. No more sending everylast person/baby from a planet you own to invade a planet you want.

    Heres an idea. Only part of your planets population is elegible to form infantry(either a constant percentage of the total planet's population or whats in the age group). When you construct a land unit it deducts from the manpower that is elegible. If you want to increase the available manpower you lower the standards of your recruits.   

A land unit can be like a folder. You can add/remove artillery, tanks whatever to the folder. The only thing that is constant is the land unit's manpower. For example an empty folder requires say 10 population points. The more stuff you add to the folder(tanks, Field hospital, upgrades etc) the more it costs to maintain a turn and the larger amount of transport space is required to move it from planet A to planet B. The land unit folder could have multiples of the same upgrade example 2 tank icons instead of just 1 tank icon.

You also have a Army folder. This army folder takes up some manpower to represent the HQ. Unlike the land unit folders this army folder does not take up any space. Its function is to link multiple land units together so they attack together/more efficently. There would be a limit to how much stuff you can cram into this folder.


[edited]

[Ravana]

The population control figures are similar to the units in ST:Armada - particularly in ST:A2. Planets produced a certain number of officers/recruits which could be "upgraded" by the building of additional space stations. (It essentially meant you had more troops to play with.)

As to the folder contents, it does make more sense then the non-descript transport we are all used to in similar games. However, I suppose the problem redflag is that diversifying the contents of our ground troops is only of use if we could utilise disparate units. Considering the status of Horizon at the moment, we won't be seeing any funky armies anytime soon.

Though think of the possibilities: we could plan our own dropship assault marines or tac-air responses!