Firstly I am still really enjoying the game but I thought I would post some feedback as too what I would like to see, as well as some wish listing of what I would love too see but its a very tall order....lol
Firstly, to me the most important area to develop is on Research from descriptions to actual applications - Asteroid mining, I want to be able to build asteroid mines etc I also would love too see lots more orbital platforms, for defence or supply/trade/scanning/Ordinance these would not only look great but really allow you to pump your most important solar systems full of orbital defence platforms making any strike in such a system require careful planning.
I also would fee that It wouldn't be too much of a stretch to really expand far more development on the Ordinance - From torpedoes, missiles, Bombs to intercept fighters, bombers, torpedo bombers, mines - (and the ability to lay mine fields) I feel this would really add a lot to the game while just expanding on the basic controls you already have in place and will really help progress the technology in a visible form. Also I would like the physical weaponry for chemical and biological warfare, this could be sent in to reverse terraform planets, to rapidly kill ship crews and everything in between.
Edit: Actually regarding fighters currently they are stupidly over powered while missiles, bombs etc are really no where good enough to justify there space requirements. Fighters should have a limited use like 3 turns before being recalled and refuelling/arming for 2 rounds. Also technologies that allow more space in ship types be it just more compact forms of gun/engine mounts to increase our options at higher technology levels it will also make the IMO poorly named 'scout' class start to gain use, as you could develop them as light attack ships with missiles/torpedoes and/or a worthwhile weapons system - cause currently even with shields, stealth and the best guns I can equip that cannot dent the shields of a cruiser... so higher tech levels giving space options to various techs/maybe by hull design.
I would also like more ships, I feel that a ship that's slightly larger than a transport but smaller than a cruiser would fit as a ship of the line so to speak and defiantly something bigger than a mother-ship - Command vessel, a carrier definitely but maybe an alternative, I like the idea that these be opened via technology.
On planets, I would like far more options that actually have very different effects - building a military colony for example would have different development options and builds than a Core world, Farming, Industrial or Mining world and they would provide different benefits, mid game onwards you just spam everything and its not very diverse/engaging and my choices have no real effect...
I would LOVE more development on the planetary invasion stuff, from actually building/developing the various forces, from launching the drop ships with escorting fighters/bombers to achieve landing against defences and ground air as well as fighting a very simple on the planet grid based/style invasion with those troops that get though... but that's wish listing really!!
Also on planetary invasions I do not like that you cannot attempt an invasion without destroying all the planets defences, I feel especially in the above planetary invasion example that going against defences, orbital and ground as well as fighting ship to ship will make a truly amazing and full filling invasion experience and will really empathise how big a deal invading an alien solar system would be! A;so give us design options for orbital stations so we can choose weapon/shielding options etc along with power systems. Maybe 4 designs like ships currently have three would do; space station style, Orbital construction ship building/Babylon 5 style station with appropriate upgrades for various fields of use, and a smaller version for small orbital mines, trade centres, supply posts. satellites/media/communication posts, or small weapon or Ordnance defence platforms.
Diplomacy needs firstly a clearer explanation and overview of the benefits to what all the agreements do, I ended up going to war with a race because I cancelled our technology agreement which instantly broke my alliance I was like WTF. We need to know what we get exactly in revenue, supply cost as well as what they get... Technology agreements, I have no idea what they accomplish or who gains what benefit - this is vital information, yes a free trade and travel policy may be worth 1bc to each third stage level colony but if its worth 3bc to the other faction then I am empowering them unknowingly!!
I also feel that a trade diplomatic option would be great, where we can swap things from resources in terms of supplying there fleets, technology, credits, planets and orbital buildings, as well as giving trade agreements and free travel policies,using there/our communications media network. military assistance (but not an alliance - so I will send my fleet to attack x solar system in support of your for 10 turns if you give me x planets and y technology) all a assigned barter value...
I would like to see more active pirate and mercenary forces, as well as the ability to hire mercenaries (HELLO cool alien ships!)
at high cost for campaigns (x years) but the different mercenaries/pirates will have there own agenda restrictions to there terms as well as charging huge sums of credits, or other form of payment (use of industrial worlds to build ships for x years, meaning you cannot) as well some such forces that seek no diplomatic options at all. Also there should be options for diplomatic sanctions, options to make weapon types as well as mass genocide type activities out considered crimes of war, that if broken will result in trade sanctions for x years from those who like you while those who do not might form a war alliance to rid the universe of you... On the same level when a friend or ally wants you to go to war if you have no out right direct issue with the faction in question, they should 'make your assistance worth it' small powers get the big ones to help and a long term cost in supply and production while a group of lesser power might form a defence pact to protect against a aggressive larger race (though how cool would it be to have betrayal here also!) We should also be able to ask for time to build our forces, or to decline to directly involve ourselves in the fighting but support a war via money/technology/supplies communications though this is technically possible currently it should be part of the same dialogue in which you were asked as to not seem that you are abandoning your friends...
Ok I think thats enough for the moment, I hope my ideas/hopes/wishes are useful and keep up the good work... If I was not hyped about this game I would not be writing such involved posts...
crimsonsun
Some ideas I would like to see in the final version..
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crimsonsun
- Explorer
- Posts: 15
Re: Some ideas I would like to see in the final version..
More I am afraid :p
It has been mentioned in other posts but some sort of espionage system would be cool, but I think you would have to go about it in a believable sense - as in how the hell would we get a spy into a alien culture simple answer we would not! Instead it would be building cloaked listening posts, blacked out stealth ships or high powered salinities to capture information of varying kinds from your target. These could be developed to provide a ever more detailed reports via technology with a different type for different information.
I also feel that the idea someone else mentioned regarding training specialist people to give you advantages in a field or another, they would get better with a small advance system based on type but would be expensive in terms of resources to produce and highly limited in availability so would need to be used wisely. So you could have An Fleet Commander, Trader/Diplomat, Espionage/assassin and a engineer type once again this will really add to re playability as it will add to your development choices and really make each play though have a different style/feel....
It has been mentioned in other posts but some sort of espionage system would be cool, but I think you would have to go about it in a believable sense - as in how the hell would we get a spy into a alien culture simple answer we would not! Instead it would be building cloaked listening posts, blacked out stealth ships or high powered salinities to capture information of varying kinds from your target. These could be developed to provide a ever more detailed reports via technology with a different type for different information.
I also feel that the idea someone else mentioned regarding training specialist people to give you advantages in a field or another, they would get better with a small advance system based on type but would be expensive in terms of resources to produce and highly limited in availability so would need to be used wisely. So you could have An Fleet Commander, Trader/Diplomat, Espionage/assassin and a engineer type once again this will really add to re playability as it will add to your development choices and really make each play though have a different style/feel....
Re: Some ideas I would like to see in the final version..
I agree with most of your points, things which would be nice to have as they expand the gameplay, though, as experience has unfortunately shown, the more complex a 4x space game becomes the more unable to handle this very complexity the AI often gets. So, as it stands the AI is very weak, at least in my games it hardly expands. I think prior to even thinking to introduce lots of additional features which from the player perspective are certainly desirable, the AI should be consolidated and made capable. I'd like to point out some other 4x games which offer on paper a formidable set of features yet but unfortunately fail rather miserably on the AI side: Space Empires V and Sword of the Stars 2.
btw
Is there already a list of features which the developers think they may be added to the game in a way they think the AI may handle them?
btw
Is there already a list of features which the developers think they may be added to the game in a way they think the AI may handle them?
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Madbiologist
- Contributor
- Posts: 98
Re: Some ideas I would like to see in the final version..
About espionage, indeed. However...
You can probably have passive information gathering (and even sometimes tech stealing opportunities) once you have heavy civilian traffic between the races. When you read what the Trade Agreements are, and what Free Travel is, then by that point when you have all of those, you pretty much have hundreds if not thousands of them (and you on them) people roaming around on their and your planets.
Obviously, there will be no infiltration via conventional means. A human doesn't quite pass of as a Kamzak at all, so he or she will always stand out. So they would need technological means to 'infiltrate' and there will be limits, but a team of changeling suits operatives doing a raid on a facility is very possible. However, you can still probably get information and maybe even steal technologies (there will be holes in customs). Also, you will have double agents, local aliens who sell out their own race for the 'right price'. Greed and mercenary behaviour doesn't suddenly disappear because the one with the wealth is of a different race. People that are willing to sell out usually don't care who pays and who they betray.
Obviously different races of different levels of how easy it is to do this. A Xenophobic race will be harder, but a race that is more open and mingles more socially will be easier. Races that value money will also be more influenced. You got to remember, with all those treaties in place, you get a free flow of people and large number of alien population 'visiting' a planet. So the people are already on your planet. When you are getting 10bc from trade and tourism each, it is not because you have aliens corded off in 'special' districts on your planet; it probably looks a lot like a scene from Babylon 5 or Star Trek with humans and aliens mingling about in many places.
Heck even in real life, a lot of spies are civilian 'tourists', merchants, and members of a diplomatic teams. Also, double agents that are payed off. The 'pretending to be them' is actually the -least- common route (used when there is a strict closed border policy). The only advantage we got on ourselves, is when we aren't suppose to be there we can pretend we do (because humans look like other humans). So once you have a free flow of alien civilians on your planet, these sort of people can easily get in and more easily find those that are willing to betray their own kind. The scenario you describe only happens during closed border scenarios where an alien couldn't set foot on your planet (and vice versa).
You can probably have passive information gathering (and even sometimes tech stealing opportunities) once you have heavy civilian traffic between the races. When you read what the Trade Agreements are, and what Free Travel is, then by that point when you have all of those, you pretty much have hundreds if not thousands of them (and you on them) people roaming around on their and your planets.
Obviously, there will be no infiltration via conventional means. A human doesn't quite pass of as a Kamzak at all, so he or she will always stand out. So they would need technological means to 'infiltrate' and there will be limits, but a team of changeling suits operatives doing a raid on a facility is very possible. However, you can still probably get information and maybe even steal technologies (there will be holes in customs). Also, you will have double agents, local aliens who sell out their own race for the 'right price'. Greed and mercenary behaviour doesn't suddenly disappear because the one with the wealth is of a different race. People that are willing to sell out usually don't care who pays and who they betray.
Obviously different races of different levels of how easy it is to do this. A Xenophobic race will be harder, but a race that is more open and mingles more socially will be easier. Races that value money will also be more influenced. You got to remember, with all those treaties in place, you get a free flow of people and large number of alien population 'visiting' a planet. So the people are already on your planet. When you are getting 10bc from trade and tourism each, it is not because you have aliens corded off in 'special' districts on your planet; it probably looks a lot like a scene from Babylon 5 or Star Trek with humans and aliens mingling about in many places.
Heck even in real life, a lot of spies are civilian 'tourists', merchants, and members of a diplomatic teams. Also, double agents that are payed off. The 'pretending to be them' is actually the -least- common route (used when there is a strict closed border policy). The only advantage we got on ourselves, is when we aren't suppose to be there we can pretend we do (because humans look like other humans). So once you have a free flow of alien civilians on your planet, these sort of people can easily get in and more easily find those that are willing to betray their own kind. The scenario you describe only happens during closed border scenarios where an alien couldn't set foot on your planet (and vice versa).
Re: Some ideas I would like to see in the final version..
Some thing I was thinking about when playing the game was if the developers are going to introduce binary or trinary star systems.
Re: Some ideas I would like to see in the final version..
Some great feedback guys. thanks!
With regards to covert operations we want to do it right when we add it. We have some great ideas but it would take too much development time away from the rest right now. So it's most likely pushed for an expansion.
With regards to covert operations we want to do it right when we add it. We have some great ideas but it would take too much development time away from the rest right now. So it's most likely pushed for an expansion.
Everything in-game or that we consider adding for the player should also be handled by the AI. That plays a big part in our design process. Hence sometimes the difficulty in adding new features because it would require a lot of time to get the AI right.salvo wrote:Is there already a list of features which the developers think they may be added to the game in a way they think the AI may handle them?
This would go on our wishlist. How would you expect it to impact the player or the game?beowulph wrote:Some thing I was thinking about when playing the game was if the developers are going to introduce binary or trinary star systems.
Horizon - Lead Designer | a.k.a. Raf